Abstract Mindstate – Interview

Pioneers of Chicago Hip-Hop, and one of the groups at the forefront of its golden age, Abstract Mindstate is currently blasting through Europe as special guests of Slum Village on their “F.U.N. Since 92” tour. A few days after they’ve rocked the house in Croatia, we got a chance to speak with Olskool Ice-Gre & E.P Da Hellcat. The story of the only male/female duo in Hip-Hop is one of the most unique in all of the culture. From making their mark on the streets of Chicago, to a lengthy hiatus from which they’ve returned with a Kanye West-produced album, and the upcoming LP, produced by Young RJ of Slum Village (out May 24th), check out the first-hand story of the synergetic marvel that is Abstract Mindstate.

While both being from Chicago, you’ve actually met at Jackson State University in Mississippi in 1990. At which moment have you decided to form a group together?

E.P Da Hellcat: It was never really a sit-down discussion about it, it just happened organically. It actually started off with three members, it was two guys, and me. But whatever would happen, it always ended up being around Olskool and I. The cohesion was there so much, there wasn’t even a reason to look outside of the group for another member. We just sounded so good together, and perfectly matched up. It was just organic and we kept it like that.

Olskool Ice-Gre: Yeah, one of our earlier groups with the other member, we used to be called Madd Skilz, and before that, I had a group called Peace Posse, and we brought E.P into the crew, because Peace Posse was a group, and a crew. It was actually a guy named Chill, who was my first rap partner, who suggested to us to form a group. He said: “man, hearing you and E.P, y’all sound really good together.“ I was a little shocked, because he and I were a group. And i was like: well, yeah. We do. ‘Cause we did a song with E.P, called “Two Poets And a Poetess“, just playing off of her name, because E.P stands for Ebony Poetess. And like E.P said, after that, organically, everything kept leading back to she and I, and here we are.

After college, both of you went back to Chicago?

E.P: After we graduated college, Olskool actually moved to L.A. and worked for Loud Records. Yeah, he has plaques all over his walls, from working on records like Only Built 4 Cuban Linx, Return To The 36 Chambers: The Dirty Version, The Infamous, was it The Infamous?

Ice-Gre: Yeah, it was The Infamous, Mobb Deep.

E.P: So he actually did some things outside Abstract Mindstate after graduating from Jackson State.

What was the air around the Hip-Hop scene in Chicago at the time you became active?

Ice-Gre: Aw, man…

E.P: Fresh, it was fresh. It was new. Although we had plenty of artists that have taken off, like Crucial Conflict or Do Or Die, the grass roots of Hip-Hop in Chicago were there, and it was so fresh and new, with all these different crews, and everybody working together and wanting to jump on each other’s projects. It was such a togetherness in the Hip-Hop community in Chicago. It was crazy, it was energetic, invigorating. It was exciting.

Ice-Gre: And I’ll say it was super original, ’cause no one sounded like each other, everyone had their own styles and their own sounds. The level of originality was smacking your face, nobody sounded the same, no matter what side of town they were from. Take Twista and Crucial Conflict, they’re both from the West Side but sound nothing alike. Do Or Die, Common, nothing alike.

In such a uniquely diverse environment, what do you think has made you stand out so much?

Ice-Gre: Abstract Mindstate, we stood out with incredible live shows. That’s what separated us from a whole lot of the groups. And a lot of the groups were great, and had great music, but not all of them had the dynamics and the energy in comparison to our live show. And that’s what really pushed us to the forefront of what we like to call “Chicago’s golden era.“ Early on, we was crazy. ‘Cause we’d always try to do something interesting on-stage to get your attention. Without acting a fool, definitely in the bounds of Hip-Hop, not making a mockery of ourselves, like we’re gonna start dancin’ or something. Just really giving you the call and response, the hand movements, the little gestures, the way we fill-in with each other. All that makes a live-show amazing.

Also, we were one of the only groups who had the city going crazy with merch, we had everything from jackets, to shirts, baseball jerseys, tank-tops, and it was all about branding, before that term became a term, but we were branding and didn’t even realize it. I think the driving point behind our marketing and promotion was, we created a really dope logo. We wanted our logo to be our version of the bat-signal. We were actually trying to compete with Hieroglyphics‘ and A Tribe Called Quest’s logo, ’cause those are some logos that don’t require you to see the actual name of what they’re representing. I bring that out, ’cause the Abstract Mindstate name, it flew around the city so crazy, either our name or logo was on something all the time, all over the city. Before you knew it, we have taken over the entire Mid-West. The entire Mid-West region knew who we are, because they’ve either heard about us, or we’ve performed somewhere close-by.

Here’s the funny thing about Abstract Mindstate, we didn’t realize we were doing that when we were doing it. We started off with our own team, kinda, and our team was just a really tight group of people that all loved each other and supported what we were doing. So, what’s tripped out about Abstract Mindstate, and what we learned years later is, some people were under the impression that we didn’t need any help or we didn’t need anyone, because everything we did was so solid and well thought-out, all our marketing and promotion was very high-level.

Your debut album, We Paid, Let Us In! was funded with money won by rap battles?

Ice-Gre: (Laugh)

E.P: I’ll “piggy-back“ on what Olskool was just saying about the perception of Abstract Mindstate, “we didn’t need anything from anybody, we had all the money we needed, we had all of this.“ What a lot of people don’t know is most of the stuff we did early-on was through funding from investors that Olskool secured, and winning contests. We did a whole album in a studio, based on winning a contest.

Ice-Gre: From winning several contests! (laugh)

E.P: CRC was the studio where R. Kelly worked, where Michael Jackson worked. We won enough money for studio time to record there. For me, the product we presented was so polished, and I think it goes back to now, a lot of people not knowing who we are, because a lot of people from Chicago, the people that were coming up, that were also in the music, they were like: this group is out there. It looked to Chicago like we were fucking huge, but we were building, just like them.

Ice-Gre: And we could have used some help. We weren’t afraid to ask, it’s just that people we asked weren’t the people that others around the scene knew. Like E.P was saying, we had investors, we found people with money, they were just outside of the normal Hip-Hop circle.

E.P: Those people we got money from had no influence in the music business, just because they had money didn’t mean they could do anything other than that.

Unfortunately, you ran into some label-related predicaments when releasing your first two albums, We Paid, Let Us In! and Still Paying. Do you have any advice for young artists, who might run into similiar situations?

E.P: My advice would be to not even do it. (laugh) Especially now, it’s so convoluted now, and if you don’t have a specific style, if you’re not unique, my advice would be: maybe do this on the side. It so different than it was in the nineties, there was so much variety back then. You were praised for being different, your novelty is what made you special. That would be one of my advising stipulations, if you’re gonna do this, stick with what makes you different. Don’t conform. Keep your artistic integrity intact.

Ice-Gre: I’ve spent more time over the last sixteen to eighteen years being behind artists, than for what we’re doing now, ’cause we stepped away for sixteen years before stepping back into it, two years ago. My advice would be kinda similiar, and that would be: just be yourself, definitely. Because, one thing i’ve noticed about the business is that as soon as someone decides to be different, or be themselves, they become a standout. And it’s weird, ’cause i don’t get why these young artists don’t pay attention, because everyone’s trying to do the same sound, the same drum patterns and so on. So, as soon you get a Joey Bada$$, or you get a Cordae, or a Denzel Curry, J.I.D., then they’re all of the focus. So I’m like: man, why don’t y’all just keep doing that? And that’s the era we came from, where everyone kept being original.

E.P: It’s art-diminishing for everybody to sound exactly the same. And I will say this: shout-out to Europe. ‘Cause we’ve been out here since, basically, the first of April. And from the radio stations, to when we go in the clubs, when we get into the elevator, the hotels, we hear real Hip-Hop! We don’t hear the garbage. And this is a respite for me.

After all the unfortunate mishaps around the first two albums, and after releasing your mixtape series, “Chicago’s Hardest Working,“ you decided to step away from making music?

E.P: It wasn’t even a decision, it happened. I think, internally, both of us were just tired.

Ice-Gre: It just became a series of almosts, it always almost happened, and then, in some crazy way… you know? It was more, like, just trying to find some peace in this stop-and-go thing. And for me, I was just trying to find a win, i just couldn’t understand why we kept hitting these walls with such a good product, such a well-seasoned group of finely-oiled machines. That space just kinda got inbetween of what Abstract Mindstate was.

In 2018, after a more than a decade long hiatus, you got a phone call from Ye, telling you that he wants to put you on the forefront of his new label/creative platform, YZY SND. Was it a tough decision to return to making music after such a long time?

E.P: It took some convincing on both of our parts, it took Ye to convince Olskool, and it took Olskool to convince me. It took me a trip out there. I had to go out there and sit with the man.

Ice-Gre: We were both on the same page in terms of thought, at different times. It was almost like trying to double-back to one of your old relationships, and you done already tried it three or four times, and you’re saying it’s not gonna work, but something about it seems like it might work. So, now you in that place, like “man, do i want to revisit this, in the place that I am now?“

E.P: The “something about it“ was Ye, that made us think it could work. That’s what he was talking about. (laugh)

Ice-Gre: At the time, in terms of where everything was, it just seemed like the perfect storm. How could we pass up on this opportunity that is being presented to us, and it was all his idea. It wasn’t like, by me spending the years around him and being all in his ear, saying “man, you should put me and E.P back out.“ Boy, did that not ever happen, it was 100% his idea. E.P said to me: “Man, he’s the biggest artist in the world,“ we had to try it.

E.P: We owed it to ourselves, if nothing else.

What was Kanye like in the studio as a producer? Was he very demanding?

Ice-Gre: He was being very challenging, yes. He was being a producer with us, being very hands-on. Every verse, he wanted to hear the playbacks, he critiqued every word. He made me rewrite almost every song on the album. You know, so what you’re hearing in Dreams Still Inspire is, I guess you could say, Kanye-approved verses. He used to say funny stuff, like, “would Nas say that?“, you know what i’m saying? So he was very hands-on, he didn’t want anyone else to help with the production. It was his personal project, that’s the part about it.

E.P: He considered it his baby. And I will say, for us to allow him to give us that level of direction was something that was unheard of. Gre was the person who A&R’d all of our stuff, he was the one who came up with all of our direction, the content and everything. So, just to allow someone to have that level of control, it was something that took some getting used to. (laugh)

So how did life change after Dreams Still Inspire dropped in 2021? Was it finally your big break, after all these years?

Ice-Gre: Yes and no. And the yes part is: man, that record traveled. We’re talking to you in Croatia, and we’re on a tour of Europe. So that record really moved around. One of the things E.P and I had a lot of fun looking at is our Spotify for Artists showing us where we were impacting, and the U.K. was our second-largest market. But just looking at the demographic, they was so young. And we was kinda impressed about it, we kinda lost faith and didn’t think kids would feel us but it was the exact opposite of that. The majority of our fan-base was young.

The no part was how the project was handled when it was finished, packaged, all of the hearts and hard work that went into it, all of the passion, the happiness. We put so much into it, and like E.P said, allowed Ye to be an actual producer, not just a beatmaker or something. We were able to be humble and disciplined enough to take it out of our hands and let him drive the car. We just played our part as lyricists, and it was great.

So, the bad part about the album was, when it came out, he or his team, nobody really acted like it was what it was. That was a very, very weird place for me, to see the excitement in his eyes and how much he played that product and talked about it around the office. And people were coming up to me, saying stuff like: “I heard about your album, Kanye was in the office, just going crazy about your record, saying this is the best album he produced in years and some of the best music he’s heard in a long time.“ So I was really excited about the potential of where Dreams Still Inspire could’ve went. And when it came out, he had so much personal stuff going on, including him deciding to do the record that you know as Donda. Everything around him took all the focus away from our release. We did get amazing press but that had nothing to do with him, or the team.

E.P: That was him, that was Olskool. And the proof of everything he just said is the fact that you didn’t know who the fuck we was, ’till we got to Croatia.

Ice-Gre: Exactly. And that shouldn’t have been the case, I mean, think about the platform we are sharing with you, we came out with a fully-produced album by Kanye, on his label, YZY SND, named after him.

E.P: The only group.

Ice-Gre: The only group to ever come out of YZY SND, and then you put on top of that, that I was one his closest friends for 23 years, that helped him become who he is. So, there was no way we thought that the ball would even remotely get dropped or fumbled, when you just look at the relationship alone. Forget business, just the relationship. ‘Cause one of the big things E.P and I always said, the biggest thing he could’ve did for us didn’t cost anything. And that was just to acknowledge it, show the world that you did it. And that wouldn’t have cost him anything, but it would have made him everything. It would have made him all of his money back, you would’ve known about us in Croatia from the time it dropped. It would have been a worldwide phenomenon.

E.P: And he didn’t.

You’re on your first European tour right now, alongside Detroit’s legendary Slum Village. Can you share some feelings from being on tour? Is it what you expected?

Ice-Gre: I can’t say I knew what to expect. I can say we always wanted it. We talked about touring the world, when we say the world, we talking about, like, Europe, Asia, Africa. We always talked about this, and how bad we wanted to do it. So I didn’t really know what to expect, heard a lot of stories. In my opinion, what makes it amazing is who we’re with. We’re with Slum Village. First of all, that group makes so much sense with us sonically. Our sounds compliment each other, our personalities compliment each other. You know what, If Slum Village would’ve went to our college, they would’ve definitely been our boys, you know what I mean? So, right now, just to speak and give the salutes and the props where it belongs, in my opinion. It’s who we’re with. Slum Village is very welcoming, they’re not divas, at all. They some real guys from the Mid-West, like us. We’re very similiar. They soulful, and they super dope too, you know. I always was a super-duper Slum fan. And they’re our brothers now.

E.P: Can you imagine going out on tour your first time, over a month long tour, with people you don’t like or don’t jam with? That being your first experience. It couldn’t have happened better, it couldn’t have been a better situation for us.

How did you get linked up with Slum Village? You guys go way back?

Ice-Gre: Yeah, I go way back with Young RJ, to probably ’05 or something. And we had a little brother-big brother relationship. He’ll tell you that, he will say, you know, “I looked at Gre as a big bro.“ And we would just talk and keep it tight. As a matter of fact, I think I may have mentioned I was the first A&R on GOOD Music, and Kanye assigned me to Big Sean. And as soon as Big Sean needed to get some work done, the first i tried to take him to is Young RJ. Because i felt like, Sean is from Detroit, Young RJ is over here with Slum, doing amazing things, let me bring those two together.

Can you tell us a bit more about the upcoming album, The Art Project?

E.P: We recorded most of the album at Young RJ’s house in Detroit. We actually lived with him, recording the record. And you can’t do that if the energy is off. It doesn’t happen if the energy is off. And I will say that this project, The Art Project, it is some of the best work we’ve ever done. It’s a different sound, as it’s evident on our latest single, “True Story,“ with Simthandile Mtolo. You can also expect another single in the next couple of weeks, called “Church Shoes.“

Ice-Gre: Also, Just to give proper credit where it’s due, RJ actually collaborated with a South African producer named Dave Audinary on “True Story.“ They actually did that, and the next single, “Church Shoes,“ that we’re gonna be putting out. The entire album is Young RJ, yes, but Young RJ, kinda similiar to Ye, he’ll collab with people. And on these particular songs on the full album, he collaborated with Dave Audinary, so he and Dave got our first two singles.

Do you guys have any merch drops planned with the new album?

Ice-Gre: We were on the phone with the team yesterday, and they was like: we gotta do vinyl on this record. So, definitely, y’all about to get some vinyl. And, of course, it’s Abstract Mindstate’s way to always have some actual T-shirts, and stuff like that. It’s just our style, we’ve done that since demos. (laugh) We’ll definitely have some merch for you guys.

Before signing off, would you guys like to give a message to people that love your music?

E.P: My message to the fans is: thank you, first of all. As long as you all rock with us, you gonna keep getting that quality. You gonna keep getting that from Abstract, keep getting that quality from Slum, keep getting that quality that you want. Don’t let your pallete be diluted by the masses. Keep real Hip-Hop alive, and that’s my message every night. So, to all the people supporting us, thank you. Because, honestly, this is the only place we can do this and be this, right now. I’m hoping that it goes back to what it used be, but right now, Europe is the only place where we can be this.

Ice-Gre: And I will say thank you, as well. Just give my half and thank you, as well. And just say: it has been an amazing experience in Europe, and we’re not even done with Europe yet. But, overall, Europe has been an amazing experience. I heard Japan is crazy, you know, and we got some things in the works. And Africa, looking forward to that. I mention those other places, not to take away from the point, i’m just saying the worldwide, outside of the U.S., support of what we’re doing, to experience it first-hand, in Croatia, or out here in the U.K., it’s an amazing experience. I can’t just say thank you enough, ’cause me and E.P, we lead those stages every night, and you can feel the spirit of Hip-Hop, and just realize: man, the time we put into this writing, it counted. You know, the thought we put into the concept of what we’re doing on stage, it counted. Everything has shown and proven itself to be worthwhile and valuable out here. So, it’s like a renewed and refreshed vigor that is kinda hard to explain, and all i’d like to say is: just thank you.

And we thank Abstract Mindstate for the conversation and all the positive vibes they bring into the world with their music. Stay tuned for their new album, The Art Project, fully produced by Young RJ of Slum Village, dropping on May 24th! Visit AbstractMindstate.com for dope merch, including physical copies of Dreams Still Inspire on CD, vinyl and cassette, as well as excellent Abstract Mindstate streetwear.